Thanks, Bernhard, for a reasoned and reasonable reply. For those who don't want to read all the
comments, including my replies, I'll reply to the original message on the OOo list, as Drew and
Andy suggested, with a reference to the Oracle announcement, as Bernhard suggests.
On Apr 22, 2011, at 04:35 , Bernhard Dippold wrote:
Hi James, all,
About this main question:
I don't know the sender, but in most cases of such mails people are not
aware of sending their full address and contact details to an public
mailing list when they write a mail from their office.
If you cite such people you probably do them a favor if you cut this
information in your reply.
In this case I feel a bit different, as the sender is senior manager of
an IT company.
So my take is: Yes - the footer doesn't hinder you to reply to his request.
He asked a question on the OpenOffice.org users list, not
Right. So if James replies, he should answer his question on the license
What Drew and Andy don't want to support, is subversive LibreOffice
marketing against OpenOffice.org.
Even if the rest of the community didn't follow us by now, we don't
think that OpenOffice.org is a competitor we have to fight against by
all possible means.
I'm not sure that using information on a public list to suggest that there might be alternatives to
the option he is suggesting on the public list can be classed as "by all possible means".
In my eyes it is allowed to inform about LibreOffice while replying to
the question on OOo license, perhaps linking to the Oracle announcement
from last Friday: As there might be major modification in OpenOffice.org
community and product structure, he should keep an eye on what's going
on in the near future. If this announcement would cause him uncertainty
about OOo's future, it might be reasonable to have a look at LibreOffice.
That was exactly my thought, although not specified in my comments. He could be going from one
closed alternative to another when an open system is available.
We should not compete against each other - especially in a situation
where none of us know, what will happen to the OOo community. Perhaps we
get a chance to re-unite: Then competitive marketing might be an issue
that adds negative feelings we should avoid.
If this became the case, I would suggest that it was because Oracle dropped OOo, in which case OOo
is joining LibO not some kind of merge.
Competitive marketing is not the way to go for LibreOffice: Italo
Vignoli, our marketing spokesperson, mentioned this point in several
mails on various lists: We stand *for* our community and our product and
not *against* others.
This is the strongest argument and the one I needed.
To forward such a message here was wrong
I have to say BS here. The information is already public, and likely to be seen by many/most on
the LibO "discuss" list.
I agree, but this doesn't mean that this topic is wrong on our discuss list.
You might have asked your question without copying the OP mail - and
have chosen a more descriptive subject ;-)
Matter of opinion - see above.
But this is not the way I think is the official position of the
Even if they decided not to follow our way by one or another reason,
these are the people we worked with for several years - and we liked
Florian was very sad that he had to resign from his OOo Marketing Lead
post - and so did the former OOo Community Council members here in the
SC as well as many others.
Not valid reasons.
Tolerance is important - for different opinions as well as for working
in two communities.
But that's just my personal opinion...
If James truly believes it is appropriate to respond to a query of
this nature, made on the OpenOffice.org mailing list, with a
recommendation to use a different application then he should (must)
be willing to do so in the open, on that mailing list.
It's just a gut feeling, but this seems to be more honest than a private
A mail to the users list will have to be phrased in a way telling just
the facts about LibreOffice without doing any harm to OOo. A private
mail could be considered as bad marketing for us, because LibreOffice
stands for openness and transparency.
In my eyes this is totally different: While Microsoft tried to turn the EU position back to
proprietary licensed software lock-in, you got notice of someone willing to switch from Microsoft
to OSS software.
And as OpenOffice.org is not (or not only) our competitor, their mailing lists are not just an
arbitrary public list.
It's good for us, if companies help others to switch from MS to OOo, because
- there is too less infrastructure (with professional support) and documentation on migrating to
- as we will prove to be better than OOo with our releases to come, people will think about
switching from OOo to LibreOffice sooner or later.
- such a change will be much easier than the previous one (and might already come true when they
try to import some VBA macros during the first process).
I will wait (nearly) 24 hours for someone from the top
of TDF to tell me no, and if that doesn't come, I will contact the
poster offline. The time now is 00:09, so TDF has until midnight
If you want a reaction by the SC, you should send a request to the SC-discuss list. Then they
will have a look at it and probably discuss it during their next call.
But at the moment all the volunteer(!) SC members have much more and much more important tasks to
solve than you mailing someone you got notice via a OOo mailing list.
I think they - or at least the marketing man - should be interested in a marketing policy question.
Sorry, but this ultimatum looks quite arrogant to me.
Looking at it again now, I can see how you would think so, and I'm sorry. It was not intended as
such. It was intended to give TPTB a chance to take a look at the issue.
I feel at the center of TDF, and I spent quite a lot of time to reply to your mail - mainly to
help the SC members to concentrate on their work.
If I was able to tell you a bit more about the special relationship between the LibreOffice and
OpenOffice.org community, the time has not been spent in vain.
You did. Thank you.
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