From: Norbert Thiebaud <nthiebaud@gmail.com>
To: steering-discuss@documentfoundation.org
Sent: Sat, 4 June, 2011 14:03:55
Subject: Re: [steering-discuss] Re: OpenOffice.org Apache Incubator Proposal:
Splitting^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^HREUNITING the Community?
>> Hi Robert,
>
> Hi Florian
>
> (Copying in Charles since he asked a similar question off list)
>
>> I'm still reading a few messages and trying to reply to them, but wanted
to
>> join in here:
>
> Just like the rest of us
>
> Noisy and open - everyone with an opinion is welcome
>
>>>
>>> The TDF is in no position to accept a major donation of either
>>> copyright or code today. Apache is.
>>
>> Why?
>
> AIUI [1] the TDF is not a legal entity today and is still in the
> process of building it's legal, organisational and process
> infrastructure.
So it was urgent as in a matter of weeks ?
> I accept it has strong legal backing but today no
> (related) US non-profit corporation exists which could accept the
> donation.
How is 'US' relevant here ?
>
> The Apache Software Foundation provides a suitable legal no-profit
> organisation and in place today a suitable process to accept large
> donations of code from major organisations safely through the
> Incubator. It has considerable experience of opening close source
> projects and in working with rich downstream ecologies.
Opening close source ? how is it relevant here ?
The proposal is to relicense an open-source project... unless I missed
something the proposal concern OOo.org not Symphony right ?
>
>> Can you elaborate?
>
> IMHO LibreOffice community finds itself in a similar position to the
> Apache group in the mid-90s. Great community. Fantastic momentum. Cool
> product.
>
> But establishing code provenance and the Apache Software Foundation
> (ASF) took a(n unexpectedly) large amount of time and energy.
> Establishing suitable licenses and agreements took time and energy
> over several iterations. Establishing a sound Incubation process took
> time and energy over many iterations. It took time for us to learn and
> evolve secure processes which don't completely suck.
That is all good, but irrelevant. we already have a license and we
would not need to incubate anything: the code base you
are trying to digest is our daily chore... It has already graduated as
a top level project
even better as THE top level project.
>
> The TDF is at the start of a journey that the ASF started a decade ago
> and is yet to reach the end.
As far as OOo.org is concerned, it is the other way around.
> The TDF may wish to consider whether an
> alternative path might achieve their aims faster...
Well, take a look: http://www.libreoffice.org/download/
I'm pretty sure that we've got nice head start...
Norbert
Hi
Yes, i think most people (lurkers) here only speak for themselves, not as
representatives of TDF, except perhaps the founder members.
The timing of this was surely chosen by Oracle rather than TDF or Apache? I'm
paranoid enough to think that Oracle deliberate chose this approximate timing
months ago, perhaps before September. That same paranoia leads me to suspect
that Oracle chose Apache to give Apache a 'mill-stone', something to sink time &
resources into without getting anything positive back, hence distracting Apache
from any on-going fights with Oracle.
Luckily, i think, they have chosen the 'wrong' people and the 'wrong' product.
Despite the efforts of Oracle since September and before OpenOffice is still a
good product with a good reputation and Apache are exactly the sort of people
most likely to be able to recover that position fast and develop from there
while doing so.
Also i think Oracle seriously underestimated how Apache are more likely to work
well with TDF, perhaps in co-operative competition or perhaps joining TDF and
resourcing a percentage of development here. At the very worst it's to keep
both products in the news which gives us both a level of free marketing.
Perhaps we should work at appearing to compete more than we really do while
splitting development costs between each other by sharing fixes and updates etc?
Regards from
Tom