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Re: [steering-discuss] Re: [libreoffice-website] Website status


Hi :)

I like the way the website is at the moment.  

I also quite like the proposed screenshot except that i would prefer the 
download button on the left so that people can access it without having to 
scroll sideways.

Ok, it may not be perfect for everyone but what we have got works well.  It 
might be a good time to stand back from the website and look at what we have 
while we push forwards in other strategic areas.  


Perfection is a great goal but we need to get basics in place first and we seem 
to already have more than that with the website.  It is pleasant, informative, 
uncluttered and fast.  It is easy to reach the download buttons.  Do we really 
need it more perfect than it is already?  I think congratulations are due to 
everyone involved and it is great that we have ideas building up and being 
finalised but i am not sure we have to action them hastily?

Anarchy?  My background is mostly in co-operative organisations 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondragon_Corporation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cooperative
but i agree that getting work done can be more important than discussions as 
long as there is room to make changes or revert to previous versions 
after-the-fact.  


I don't see this as a contradiction but many people new to co-operatives or 
other non-hierarchical structures often assume that discussion about every tiny 
point is vital.  It isn't.  Getting the job done is usually far more important.  
The wider group may set policy or determine "house/company style" based on early 
experimentation.  


Anyone 'should' be free to express an opinion and "stupid questions" may reveal 
a possibility for useful innovation but the people doing the work have to be 
free to get on with the work.  Ideas and suggestions are good if they help get 
the work done but if they are not immediately useful they 'should' be ignored or 
allowed to grow into something more useful later.  


Anyone 'should' be free to do sundry jobs under the direction of the main 
worker(s) as though being mentored for a while if that helps get the work done.  
It sometimes helps to split into 'temporary' roles such as one person/group 
working mainly on content and the other mainly on look-and-feel, each able to 
make suggestions to the other team/person.

Note that 4/5 (80%) of new businesses FAIL in the first 2 years when they are 
set up in a "traditional" hierarchical format with 1 top boss dictating and 
no-one else feeling like they have any ownership of the project.  By contrast 
only 2/5 (40%) of new worker co-operatives fail in the first 2 years.  
Innovation is crucial and we seldom get that from 1 single leader.  The trick is 
getting people empowered, perhaps helping finding/developing their best area, so 
they can work on the projects too.

I don't really think we need to discuss this now and it might be disruptive to 
do so.  It is worth considering that we need a more fluid dynamic here than most 
people are used to in the outside world.

I hope this helps otherwise just ignore it!
Good luck and regards from
Tom :)





________________________________
From: David Nelson <commerce@traduction.biz>
To: steering-discuss@documentfoundation.org
Sent: Wed, 22 December, 2010 0:54:11
Subject: [steering-discuss] Re: [libreoffice-website] Website status

Hi, :-)

On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 07:39, Bernhard Dippold
<bernhard@familie-dippold.at> wrote:
Hi David, all,

once again, please don't think I would not appreciate your great work, even
if I try to improve the "look and feel" of the welcome page.
<snip>
Please have a look at Christoph's proposal:
http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/bbnG0Hny0SpccJIZsGp72A?feat=directlink

I must admit that, personally, I don't find this layout attractive at
all, although it gives some general indicators about content
positioning.

I'm sorry, that I can't design a mockup at the moment. Time is short even
for adding the short phases...

I *have* read your ideas, and will carefully read them and think about
them again as I finish off this first version of the site content. I
am doing my best to take account of your comments and the comments of
other people in what I'm doing. But, sometimes, the proposals and
reactions are so sharply contrasting that it is difficult or
impossible to please everybody.

The problem is that it is *extremely* difficult to work in the current
situation: it's a kind of contributive anarchy, with no-one having a
clearly-appointed lead role in particular areas of the project. Thus,
the only conclusion you can arrive at is this: the people that
actually *do* work are the ones that get to call the shots. If they
are good community members, they will do their best to take account of
other people's opinions. But, in many cases, one has to take a
decision, and the decision will inevitably dissatisfy someone.

Such is the case in what I'm presently doing. I observed how, after
long discussions on the mailing lists and various conference calls,
the website team had failed to put any IA together, and had failed to
put even as much as 10 words on any single page. So I jumped in and
started working on my own. Even when I asked for quick and concrete
contributions, I only got help with content from a couple of people
(apart from lots of patient technical support from Christian).

I do want to get feedback from people, and to take account of their
ideas, but I don't have time or patience to be spending all my time
writing to mailing lists. I actually want to *do* work *now*.

I'm aware that the content I've put on the site is not perfect, and
that it's open to revision in the future. But it does have the merit
of *actually existing* and being sufficient to roll out the site.

I'm determined to finish off what I started, but I do ask you to
remember that I, too, only have 24 hours in my day, and also have a
life to deal with outside the project. So please forgive me for any
shortcomings you perceive in what I produce. ;-) We can look at things
again in the New Year.

I will be doing my best to take account of all I've read. :-)

I'm currently negotiating with Florian, Christian and Christoph to see
whether to proceed with changes to the SilverStripe theme, or whether
to set this issue aside for someone else to decide about at sometime
in the future.

I hope you understand my position, guys. ;-)

David Nelson

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