[steering-discuss] contracting a lawyer for the foundation's set-up process

Hello,

as many of you know, we're right before filing the application for legally setting up the Foundation.

For the process of filing, it is highly advisable to have a lawyer assisting us and acting as official point of contact. Not only will some legal topics come up, but also being represented by a lawyer greatly helps in being perceived as serious entity by the authorities.

Among the lawyer's tasks there will be the communication with the authorities, acting on legal questions, and preparing the filing documents in a way they fit the legal requirements. Unfortunately, German law makes it very complicated for lawyers to act pro bono on these kinds of things (which is different to e.g. the US), so we plan to officially contract a lawyer to assist us.

In order to have legal advice for the process, which might take a few weeks, I'd like to ask the steering committee to approve a sum of 3.000,- € in total. This is the sum one of our preferred lawyers has mentioned to us, and given that several hours of work for professional services have to be invested, I consider that amount very well spent.

Depending on the lawyer and the services used, hourly rates of about 50-150 € are fairly normal in Germany, and I expect the process to take a few hours of time to be completed, especially given the "speciality" with the membership we have come up with.

Thoughts welcome.

Florian

A lawyer is indispensable I think, and the fees sound reasonnable . +1

Charles.

Hello,

as many of you know, we're right before filing the application for
legally setting up the Foundation.

For the process of filing, it is highly advisable to have a lawyer
assisting us and acting as official point of contact. Not only will some
legal topics come up, but also being represented by a lawyer greatly
helps in being perceived as serious entity by the authorities.

Among the lawyer's tasks there will be the communication with the
authorities, acting on legal questions, and preparing the filing
documents in a way they fit the legal requirements. Unfortunately,
German law makes it very complicated for lawyers to act pro bono on
these kinds of things (which is different to e.g. the US), so we plan to
officially contract a lawyer to assist us.

In order to have legal advice for the process, which might take a few
weeks, I'd like to ask the steering committee to approve a sum of
3.000,- € in total. This is the sum one of our preferred lawyers has
mentioned to us, and given that several hours of work for professional
services have to be invested, I consider that amount very well spent.

Depending on the lawyer and the services used, hourly rates of about
50-150 € are fairly normal in Germany, and I expect the process to take
a few hours of time to be completed, especially given the "speciality"
with the membership we have come up with.

Thoughts welcome.

Florian

--
Florian Effenberger <floeff@documentfoundation.org>
Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation
Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff

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Hi :slight_smile:
I thought that was the purpose of the fund-raising that was a huge success.
Proper accountants would have wrapped-up all these extra costs into the amount
originally asked for. I kept quiet at the time because we were uncertain about
whether that much could be raised. Hindsight is great like that.

The money is there for these extra costs and this is exactly what it was raised
for. Skimping on these costs could end up costing TDF a LOT more if not done
well enough first time. I thnk it's also worth looking around for better
qualified lawyers with more experience in this area of law rather than just
going for the ones with the cheapest quote.

Regards from
Tom :slight_smile:

Hi :slight_smile:
+1
definitely.
Regards from
Tom :slight_smile:

+1

David

I'm not sure if I'm able to vote on this matter. But if so, +1

Florian Effenberger wrote:

In order to have legal advice for the process, which might take a
few weeks, I'd like to ask the steering committee to approve a sum
of 3.000,- € in total.

+1 - this has my approval.

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

+1

Best Regards

Varun

Good night!

I understand that is a decision of the SC, but I will give my opinion. Totally agree

Best regards.

Eliane Domingos de Sousa
gtalk/skype: elianedomingos
twitter: eliane_domingos
identica/facebook: elianedomingos

Hi,

Von: Florian Effenberger <floeff@documentfoundation.org>

For the process of filing, it is highly advisable to have a lawyer
assisting us and acting as official point of contact. Not only will some
legal topics come up, but also being represented by a lawyer greatly
helps in being perceived as serious entity by the authorities.

...

In order to have legal advice for the process, which might take a few
weeks, I'd like to ask the steering committee to approve a sum of
3.000,- € in total.

+1

regards,

André

Hi,

In order to have legal advice for the process, which might take a few
weeks, I'd like to ask the steering committee to approve a sum of
3.000,- € in total.

+1

thanks. We right now have 4 out of 6 necessary votes, so I will wait before closing the ballot.

BTW, in the meantime I researched a bit, and got also feedback from the lawyer we plan to contract, and in fact, the hourly rates seem to be higher as anticipated. Several German websites talk about hourly rates with an average of 180 €, not going below 120 €, so my assumption with 50 € was obviously too low. In a nutshell: Based on the normal sums occuring, that fixed price of 3.000 € indeed sounds like a very good deal.

Florian

Hi Florian, all!

>> In order to have legal advice for the process, which might take a few
>> weeks, I'd like to ask the steering committee to approve a sum of
>> 3.000,- € in total.
>
> +1

thanks. We right now have 4 out of 6 necessary votes, so I will wait
before closing the ballot.

Since Sophie did not reply so far, here is the deputy's vote: +1

Cheers,
Christoph

Hi all,
[...]

In order to have legal advice for the process, which might take a few weeks, I'd like to ask the steering committee to approve a sum of 3.000,- € in total.

+1
Kind regards
Sophie

Oups, sorry Christoph, I didn't see your mail before posting mine. Thanks for taking care and sorry also for the delay in my answer to the vote.
Kind regards
Sophie

Ditto from me I guess :slight_smile:

  ATB,

    Michael.

+1

Hello,

I just counted the votes, and I found at least these voting +1:

Florian
Charles
Italo
Thorsten
André
Sophie

Plus Michael and Christoph and deputies, plus some "non-binding" votes, so I hereby close the vote and just added it as an official decision to http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/TDF/BoD_Decisions

@André: I ws not sure on how to reflect the current voting - Michael and Christoph voted +1, but the seat holders they are deputies for voted themselves. I wrote "approved with votes of 8 voting members (including two deputy votes)" - should that be just 6 voting members instead, to make clear only 6 people had "valid" votes?

Thanks for your support!
Florian

I thought I voted yet....

+1

Olivier

Hi :slight_smile:
I think that counts as 6 votes with none against, so it's "nem con" or
something. The votes from deputies doesn't count if the people they are
deputies for have voted. Not that it makes much difference since it's still a
strong majority with none against.

Regards from
Tom :slight_smile:

Hi Tom,

I think that counts as 6 votes with none against, so it's "nem con" or
something. The votes from deputies doesn't count if the people they are
deputies for have voted. Not that it makes much difference since it's still a
strong majority with none against.

I think so, too - but André planned the page, so maybe he has some insight on how to have the wording :wink:

Florian